Divine Shield!

Summary:

I'd like to see some changes to Divine Shield, basically to make it more reliable.. here are my ideas: (sure it's been thought of before)

Divine Shield!

striffen 1257175409|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

1. Give Divine Shield the ability to be recast during it's duration, so that you can keep the Dodge AC up for a long duration if you keep track of it.. the 1 round you are w/o it when you need to recast it can be devastating.. and I don't feel it should be like that.
2. Input a Feat that increases it's duration (like epic divine might).. there isn't really any point to double the dodge ac because of the +20 dodge cap, since the dodge AC shouldn't be doubled perhaps the Epic Divine Shield should give something else along with the longer duration.. like a feat that works under the duration (like evasion during whirlwind rage).. something that fits the concept.

I prefer the first one, most spells renews the duration when cast, like concealment, or sirine's grace which I also rely on in a hard battle.

Re: Divine Shield!

Kaedrin 1257202578|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

PnP it's a 0 delay, 1 round duration effect. It's far, far better right now than it is in pnp.

Re: Divine Shield!

striffen 1257210037|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

Yeah but in PnP you don't need to think quick like in NWN. Being able to recast during it's duration would be a balanced way to make it more reliable imho.. you don't share this thought with me?

last edited on 1257210366|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover by striffen + show more

Re: Divine Shield!

Kaedrin 1257211140|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

Let me ask this question: What build do you want this changed for? I'm sure there's a reason you want it buffed up.

Re: Divine Shield!

striffen 1257256654|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

Well I've played several builds that uses divine shield, if there is a epic divine might shouldn't there be an epic divine shield? Shouldn't every spell that you recast renew the duration? I had no idea it was that weak in PnP but the 0 delay and noaction pace of PnP at least allows you to have it up and running for as long as you have turn undead's to spare right?

But to answer your question: I'm playing on RoT, and I'm using a lvl 21 bard variant with 1 cleric level for turn undead amongst other things. The combination of the bugged Requiem canceling my inspiration plus divine shield AC missing for 1 round because it cannot be renewed or extended makes my AC very jumpy and unreliable.. it's the only non dexer build that I've come up with that can reach a high effective AC, but too keep it up I rely on alot of short duration buffs and have other weaknesses like every build does.

If epic divine shield also required 22 str 22 charisma it would be a nice way for full plate builds to get closer to the dexers with monk/duelist imo.

Is the ability to renew the duration really such a buff? It will probably still run out from time to time, it will require some skill to keep it up for the entire fight (if it's a long one).

last edited on 1257256850|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover by striffen + show more

Re: Divine Shield!

nicethugbert 1257265314|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

Isn't Divine Shield already an instant feat?

With one cleric level don't you have less than a hand full of uses already? Why would you want to shorten the use time to one round when you can only use it ~3 times a day, even 9 times? With a +9 cha bonus you already get 9 rounds out of one use and you have more than one use so you are already better off as is then with your suggestion.

Re: Divine Shield!

striffen 1257266690|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

I think you misunderstood me, I don't want it to be like in PnP I just want to be able to recast it before it runs out like any other spell :) So that I can have it running as long as I have turn undeads left =) higher charisma will allow me to recast less often along with a higher dodge ac boost =)

Re: Divine Shield!

nicethugbert 1257269508|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

It would be a very nice feature for all casters if they could extend their buffs with consecutive casts of their buffs. Cast the same buff X times would make the buff last X times as long.

Re: Divine Shield!

Kaedrin 1257270967|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

I'll remove the recast block from Divine Shield. There is no epic divine shield in PnP nor do I intend to make one up for NWN2 unless it required epic Paladin.

Stacking durations is completely unfeasible for many reasons (non pnp, we have no hooks to get an effects remaining duration, handling multiple casters/caster levels).

Re: Divine Shield!

striffen 1257272728|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

If I understood you correctly Kaedrin, you're saying that you will actually make this change? Divine Shield will be able to be recasted during it's duration? If yes, then when can I expect this change to go live? In the next update? Also any plans about the Requiem *bug* that makes it cancel inspirations?

I have a good understanding of the english language but it hurts me to say this.. I'm not entirely sure what you mean with the last sentense tbh, I'm Swedish =)

Re: Divine Shield!

Mammothtruk (guest) 1257273413|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

Kaedrin is saying that he can remove the block to recast during the duration, but he cant make it add durations. It will just reset the duration when you recast Divine Shield. There are two reasons for this. 1. its not PnP 2. there is no script hook to get remaining duration of an effect.

Now if you were to rewrite every spell that has a duration to include a duration heartbeat that counts down rounds you could in theory grab the remaining time left on each effect, however you would bring down the engine around it due to every single spell counting down a heartbeat. However you would be able to have stacking durations if you were so inclined to do all the work on all the spells. I believe the heartbeat would have to be placed on the PC or NPC its counting for tagged with the spell name, because Im pretty sure it has to be an object that its applied to.

Thats what he means by unfeasible.

Re: Divine Shield!

striffen 1257274513|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

I never wanted the duration to stack.. (1) e.g charisma modifier 10, divine shield has lasted 5 rounds and have 5 rounds duration left, I cast it again then duration is increased to 15 rounds remaining..

(2) I want it to be.. I recast it with 1-5 rounds remaining and it's renewed to 10 rounds duration.

I feel especially dense today since you have to explain this to me over and over I just want to make sure I get it right..

Is it situation (1) you're saying is virtually impossible, or is it both.. because it's situation (2) that I've wanted all along. Situation (1) would make divine shield a viable but arguably OP dodge buff that would be annoying to both have and not have since you would stand before each battle charging it =).
Situation (2) however would make divine shield more reliable IF you stay on your toes in a hard fight, rather than pray you don't get squished during the downtime.

Re: Divine Shield!

Mammothtruk (guest) 1257277905|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

right case 1 is virtually impossible do to the strain on the engine and the shear amount of work involved in making heartbeat counters. Case 2 is completely doable and from what Kaedrin is saying he isnt opposed to doing.

Sounds like you have a grasp on the ideas laid out and the recast to reset the timer before it wears off that just resets its 10 round timer sounds like its going to happen.

Dont feel bad about being dense as I feel that way all the time. Sometimes I have to reread something 5 and 6 times to pick out just what the person is trying to say so I understand where they are coming from and what they are trying to say. At least you didnt through the normal ZOMG underPOwReR/OVAPOWERED response that normal happen. Much better to reexplain and reask something til its clear in my not so humble opinion. Savvy?

Re: Divine Shield!

Mammothtruk (guest) 1257278025|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

right case 1 is virtually impossible do to the strain on the engine and the shear amount of work involved in making heartbeat counters. Case 2 is completely doable and from what Kaedrin is saying he isnt opposed to doing.

Sounds like you have a grasp on the ideas laid out and the recast to reset the timer before it wears off that just resets its 10 round timer sounds like its going to happen.

Dont feel bad about being dense as I feel that way all the time. Sometimes I have to reread something 5 and 6 times to pick out just what the person is trying to say so I understand where they are coming from and what they are trying to say. At least you didnt through the normal ZOMG underPOwReR/OVAPOWERED response that normal happen. Much better to reexplain and reask something til its clear in my not so humble opinion. Savvy?

Re: Divine Shield!

striffen 1257283144|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

Haha sounds good, would be awesome if it could be recast!

And to think somebody with XP listening to what I have to say and actually willing to take the time to change this at my request, just makes me feel like I can make a difference. Wonderful feeling, I really hope you can find the time to change this for me(us) Kaedrin. Appriciate you hearing me out, and the humble responses =)

Hope you can understand my english as I'm just rambling on here.

// Robin

Re: Divine Shield!

Celestial Knight 1257284971|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

look at his wip in 1.39 he already did change it :P

Re: Divine Shield!

striffen 1257286138|%e %b %Y, %H:%M %Z|agohover

Wohoo! Hope 1.39 arrives soon and is implemented on Realms of Trinity where I spend my time ;)!

Kick ASS!